Trinitarians making their proof for existence of God look ridiculous #1

Long before we started this website we encountered several so called Christian websites which tried to explain that there is a God Who exist and created everything. To proof there is that God they used mostly proofs of the existence of Christ Jesus. Some even went so far going to say that Jesus had to be God because he came out of the dead. Those writers forget that there have been many others before Jesus who also walked out the grave or where taken out of the death by prophets. Then one could say the girl made to live again by Isaiah also could be God or then Lazarus would also be God, because he too walked out of his grave.

We did not take note of all those websites which told such things to proof Jesus is God, because we never thought we would have to tackle such subject in the prospect of comparing the view of trinitarians and non-Trinitarians. In the past, at our main site we just looked at the existence of God from the biblical point of view and from human reasoning, looking at the points of view of the non-believers and believers. We originally never had the intention of going to proof how the view of the trinitarians endangered the proof for the existence of God, until we had enough of all the attacks of trinitarians against us and their refusal to see how some of their proves that Jesus is God just do damage or even totally undermine a proof for the existence of The God.

The trinitarians also very often give others right to think God must be a very cruel being. Richard Dawkins the most prominent of the “new atheists” once wrote:

“[God is] a vindictive bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser , a misogynistic, homophobic racist, an infanticidal, genocidal, phillicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”

And when we look at some visions of certain trinitarian preachers who make people afraid with eternal torture by hellfire one might think Dawkins and many others who believe God must be cruel could make a serious point. Some contemporary minds wonder if our world would not be better with an other role model than the one they call ‘God’, by which they than mean ‘Jesus’. No wonder atheists and other-believers do not know to make a difference between Jesus or a god son and God, when so many Christians take Jesus as their god and even dare to say that it was Jesus who

occasionally judged whole societies versus individuals. Some examples are: the flood [which]  killed everyone but Noah’s family, the death of Egypt’s firstborn and the cleansing of the Canaanites out of Palestine. These certainly don’t look like a God of love. {Giving Christ in his article: But the Bible Speaks of a Cruel God}

Several people are convinced “God” is a fantasy of man and the world does not need a god at all.

scientific discovery has now explained the world we experience so well that there is no reason to think that God was necessary to make it happen. {Has Science Disproved God?}

The organisation Giving Christ writes

Logic would tell you that if God is all-powerful and His desire is to save all, then all will be saved. {The Theologians’ Cross}

Which brings us to the greatest point to which people are going to say

See there is no such thing as an all-knowing God.

Which is very logic when they and we, look at Jesus, the person those preachers, pastors, ministers and priests call their god. More than once that Nazarene master teacher says he cannot do anything without God, Who knows everything and can do everything, and Jesus says clearly it is not given to him to know all those things people ask him, like when would be the end-times, when would he be coming back and who would be seated next to him.

The trinitarians claim that Jesus is God, but at the same time they say God is an eternal all-knowing being. At the same time they want to proof that Jesus existed, was born (had a beginning) and died (had an end) and came out of the dead, later to be taken up in heaven. No wonder others find it ridiculous than to believe Jesus would be God and that there is a God. Trinitarians clearly have proven that their god Jesus has no eternality nor immortality and does not tell the truth, if he would know everything, which clearly makes him a very cruel god. His coming out from the grave and his appearance afterwards could as well be a trick or illusion, like it also could be an illusion by others which seemed to have come out of death and later died again. Those ‘bringers to life again’ being very good illusionists.

For many anti-Jehovah people it might be clear that when Jesus is the only way to eternal life and Christians telling.

If there were alternate routes, then Jesus would not have been asked to do what He did. {The Theologians’ Cross}

it sounding strange when God would have been asked to do something by whom to come to earth to fake his temptation (because in the Bible it is said God cannot be tempted) and to fake man can do him something (because again the Bible let us know man can do God nothing) and then to fake his death (because God cannot die). No wonder many may think that ‘god-doing’ or ‘god-theory’ is all fantasy and others may utter

Jesus’ incarnation, life, forsakenness, death and resurrection is an awful costly way to create a way to Heaven. {The Theologians’ Cross}

Many people also hear Christians talking about Jesus, God, Holy spirit, Narrow Way, etc; saying God is no liar and that He has given His Word, which tells the world the truth, though they see many of those preachers even do not believe the words of that God Who declares that man in the river Jordan to be His only begotten son. They find it a big joke that those who claim

The Bible has more than 5000 existing hand-written manuscripts or portions of manuscripts of the New Testament. Many of these dated within 200 years of the original. No other notable document of antiquity has anywhere near that.{You Can’t Trust the Bible}

and further say they believe it always says the truth and that

Because there are so many, exhaustive comparative study has been done to look for variations due to copying error or intentional redaction. Those things exist, but they are readily identified. The result is that we can be pretty darn sure what the originals said. {You Can’t Trust the Bible}

they wonder why they themselves do not believe the printed versions or exclude other versions than for example the King James Bible.

The opponents of Christendom and Christianity may also question why certain Christians ask them why Jesus would not have been able to transmit something to others when he was already many years death or having disappeared for decades.

If Jesus did these things, don’t you think He would be able to transmit the truth through human writers even a few decades later? {You Can’t Trust the Bible}

They, like us, may wonder why those Christians who say Jesus is god do not accept Jesus his words nor the Words of the One Who calls Himself God. Can it be that

some dismiss the story and words of Jesus is because they don’t like them or they are afraid. {You Can’t Trust the Bible}

Mosaic from Pompeii depicting Plato’s academy

Many atheists who think God does not exist, say then also, Jesus can not have existed. They forget Jesus was a rebellious master teacher who really existed and about whom more is written than many of who nobody seems to doubt their existence, like DracoPlato of Athens, Aristotle,  Dionysius of Halicarnassus, Lucius Junius Brutus, and many others. Naturally they being confronted by people who say Jesus is God want to deny than also the existence of Jesus, instead of trying to proof to those trinitarians there are enough reasons to believe Jesus can not be God. But that last matter they probably dare not to do because then they would have to have a definition for or have to know the attributes of That God. When rejecting a belief in God or gods it would be very difficult to use a definition of a god or The God to proof Jesus is not God.

Christian Atheist (Peter Lumsden, d. 2007)
Christian Atheist (Peter Lumsden, d. 2007) (Photo credit: Wikipedia)

We can give them the simple answer just to use the Bible as the best tool to debunk such an idea of that divine man of bones, flesh and blood to be God.

Though at the moment, many seeing all the lies and hypocrisy of many Christian Churches, makes them leaving the Church and not worrying about faith or religion any more.

The trend toward agnosticism, atheism, and other forms of unbelief is gathering force, especially among the young. And churches simply don’t know how to counter it. {Shane Hayes in his book The End of Unbelief: A New Approach to the Question of God}

If churches would go back to the source of everything and knowledge, back to the Unseen Only One True God and His infallible Word (the Bible) many more people would be able to gain faith again in That Divine Creator.

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Preceding

Possible arguments and proofs about the existence of God #1

Possible arguments and proofs about the existence of God #2

A Book to trust #6 True God and true words

A Book to trust #7 Heavenly Father not withholding knowledge

A Book to trust #14 Writings to show The God #1 The I Am that I Am

The Holy Scripture – The One Only Source of the Holiness of the Word

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Additional reading

  1. Caricaturing and disapproving sceptics, religious critics and figured out ethics
  2. Science, scepticism, doubts and beliefs
  3. Science and God’s existence
  4. Scientific Evidence for God
  5. Cosmos creator and human destiny
  6. Is faith rational?
  7. Belief of the things that God has promised
  8. Are people allowed to have doubts
  9. Pascal’s Possibility
  10. God isn’t dead though for many He is not relevant
  11. Why think there’s a God? (1): Something from Nothing
  12. Why think that (4) … God would reveal himself in words
  13. Why think there is a God (4): And the Rest …
  14. The very very beginning 2 The Word and words
  15. Gone astray, away from God
  16. Does He exists?

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Related

  1. Stop saying that it’s ‘obvious’ that God exists
  2. Is God, as First Cause, a Numerical First of Many Causes?
  3. Existence of God (furtusammu)
  4. The existence of God
  5. Can We Be Certain of God’s Existence?
  6. Is the Existence of God Compatible with the Existence of Evil?
  7. Possible arguments and proofs about the existence of God #2
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